Sablinker
Sablinker OP wrote
Reply to comment by !deleted8445 in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
I'm a communo-mutualist, lol
Sablinker OP wrote
Reply to comment by lori in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
They will try to take as much as they can "legitimately" take without looking suspicious/like assholes. As long as they can get away with this, they'll do it!
All of this, while putting the minimal amount of work
Sablinker OP wrote
Reply to comment by !deleted8871 in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
who is going to be willing when they can just take it for free themselves?
Outside world / capitalist world (unless we live in a post scarcity society, but by this time property is useless and ANY resource management system will be an utopia)
I don't think free riders would be as common as people seem to try to make out
Maybe...
Sablinker OP wrote
Reply to comment by mofongo in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
Much more interesting and reasonable.
Who decides the number of "socially necessary labor time"?
Sablinker OP wrote
Reply to comment by ziq in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
There's no money and everything is free so how can you sell free stuff and make profit?
So, the whole world need to be ancom for it to be working lol.
If It's not the case I can barter/sell my stuff to people who are willing.
And like I said free rider problem. Some people won't be willing to work and will just want to take. This may decrease people motivations, everyone will just take at the end and everything will collapse quite fast
Code it yourself. Why should anyone labor to code for you when you just take take take
I like to be good at multiple things, but I also believe in the division of labour. I can't DIY EVERY SINGLE THING IN MY LIFE. Did you DIY your smartphone/computer? Did you mine the resources to create it yourself...etc And that's just the beginning. Now, let's talk about everything else!
Sablinker wrote
Reply to comment by ziq in by !deleted16100
It's useless, only the working class will be affected. Rich people and politicians won't give a fuck
Sablinker OP wrote
Reply to comment by ziq in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
labor vouchers aren't ancom, they're anarcho-collectivist. ancoms don't have any kind of currency. you just take whatever you want from the communal stores.
Then, how do you solve the free rider problem?
I am just going to take, take, take, take and never contribute. What prevents me from doing this? What prevents me from taking a lot of your stuff and reselling it for profit?
so why would they fill it with bugs?
Incompetence, mistakes, human errors
Sablinker wrote
Reply to comment by ziq in by !deleted16100
it makes more sense to focus on roads. if people amassed and blocked the roads on a daily basis, cars would no longer be useful
You want to reduce the freedom of movement of people?
Sablinker OP wrote
Reply to comment by ziq in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
I live in an ancom community, I ask someone to code a software for me.
Person A gives me a program full of bugs and very ugly.
Person B gives me a very clean program.
Do you really think that they are both the same!!!?
Sablinker OP wrote
Reply to comment by lori in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
No, we don't. That's patently ableist to value people on the amount of output rather than by the amount of effort. Its a terrible system.
I value both & more hours is not always equal to more effort.
But I mainly value demand.
what I would consider bullshit work
Or you know someone is productive
the whole system now where if you have an 8 hour shift and finish your work in 3 hours, you're fucked over because you're perceived as "not working" for having worked.
Except when you work in task-based work environments, they are plenty of them
And presumably it wouldn't be hard to tell you weren't typing for 3 hours, so your comrades in commune would have reason to confront you for not offering work according to your ability.
Good Luck! I am a good actor ;) Or I can work at home too, ya know.
It will be even harder to detect when the task takes multiple days or even MULTIPLE MONTHS
Sablinker OP wrote (edited )
Reply to comment by ziq in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
That's a problem. Because I have an incentive to be LESS productive.
The optimal play for me is to shut up.
The community who needs my job lost a nice opportunity...
Sablinker OP wrote
Reply to comment by lori in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
the contest isn't between who flips burgers fastest, and that shouldn't be the concern.
It's exactly the concern. We want people who work harder a.k.a labourers to make more money. The less pleasant the task: the better the reward.
Then clearly their job wasn't needed. If there's labor vouchers, bullshit work would hopefully be wiped out anyways.
I'll give you an example.
I am paid to write a few articles about an anarchist commune. I have 4 hours to do all of this. I finished the job in 1 hour, because I am productive. Should I stay silent or announce that my work is done. If I do the latter I am only paid 1 hour, whereas If I keep my trap closed I am paid 4 hours. Why should I speak up?
A task-based system would easily solve this problem but I don't know If anarchists are willing to go for it...
Sablinker OP wrote
Reply to comment by lori in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
yeah I'm not convinced for these vouchers story...
It gives workers an incentive to stall the clock and more efficient workers don't have anything to gain
And what If you don't know who these assholes are & can't detect them lol
Sablinker OP wrote
Reply to comment by ziq in What's the difference between vouchers and money? by Sablinker
What happens If someone finish the job earlier but refuse to tell anyone then?
He'll have more vouchers If he doesn't tell anyone that the job is done?!
Sablinker wrote
Reply to What's the difference between socialism and capitalism with a large welfare system? by TanktopTiger
Free market capitalism?
Or capitalism with a state (crony capitalism)?