Viewing a single comment thread. View all comments

southerntofu wrote

Reply to comment by ruin in insurrection by Tonic

Because they were denounced for their misogynistic views. This book explained that young girls are the ultimate symptom of capitalism, because they are only worried about appearance and consuming makeup and whatnot. This is of course not true of all girls, including gender-conforming ones. And the book did not mention how gendered consumerism affected young boys on the other hand, if i remember.

So it was along the lines of "girls with makeup are the face of capitalism", which thankfully they renounced following harsh criticism.

3

ruin wrote

Have you read the text? The intro addresses both age and sex. They use Berlusconi as a “young girl” if I recall correctly.

The text is a societal/cultural critique about the commodification, production and consumption of an unattainable and transient quality of “youth” and “beauty” (regardless of gender) and the destructive nature of this process in the broadest possible sense.

I was genuinely curious what the renunciation entailed.

4

southerntofu wrote

Have you read the text?

Yes, but admittedly a very long time ago so i don't remember the details. Sorry if my account was unfaithful to the original text. I'm unaware of an official rebuttal, but every occasion i had to debate this issue with appellists they consistently said this text had been denounced by its authors.

The text is a societal/cultural critique about the commodification (...) of “youth” and “beauty”

Yes, that is an interesting critique. But for example, Mia Mingus' Beyond desirability did not leave me with such a bitter, reactionary taste as Tiqqun did.

4

ruin wrote

Yes, that is an interesting critique. But for example, Mia Mingus' Beyond desirability did not leave me with such a bitter, reactionary taste as Tiqqun did.

Creating a bad taste is kind of what Tiqqun is about. I’m completely on board with you on their shit politics, and I’m not revolution minded myself, but I can’t help but have a soft spot for the nihilistic antisocial aspect to their output of critique.

I think Theory of Bloom is even more of an example of their style overburdening the substance. It can be read as an update of Marcuse’s One Dimensional Man for a more modern era but written in bizarre esoteric quasi-intellectual prose as opposed to Marcuse’s (relatively speaking) approachable language and general concision.

I genuinely appreciate your perspective. I have no association with France and don’t speak a word of the language, but a large section of my bookshelf has always been occupied by French thinkers. Pretty sure I’ve got a 1968 copy of a translation of the French student revolt interviews floating around here somewhere... along with Marcuse, Foucault, Sartre, Nin, Deleuze, De Beauvoir, etc and even (somewhat embarrassingly now) Malraux.

3

southerntofu wrote

I’m not revolution minded

I am revolution minded, but i don't believe in spontaneous insurrection of "the masses". I think revolutionary consciousness is built on material solidarity and day-to-day empowerment of our communities, not abstract theory.

bizarre esoteric quasi-intellectual

Reading the invisible committee (at least in french) is indeed a mystical, messianic adventure. And it is far from approachable for people without higher education in the social sciences (like myself).

my bookshelf has always been occupied by French thinkers

You may appreciate more modern reads :)

I'm thinking Mathieu Rigouste, Fatima Ouassak, Said Bouamama, among many others. Another interesting one is Christine Delphy. She is rightfully criticized for some trans-exclusionary positions, but still has very interesting analyses of race-class-gender intersectionality in the context of french imperialism and patriarchy. Not sure if you can find all those in english though :)

3

ruin wrote

Thanks for the suggestions!

I’m quite out of date. Much of my engagement with the authors I mentioned is due to that when I was younger my reading was dictated by what I could pick up cheaply at used book shops.

I’m not educated either. I just bounce around engaging with whatever I find interesting and useful to me.

I agree that revolutionary action is a practical undertaking, but I also value abstract theory in the sense that in order to act in a truly revolutionary manner we must first destroy our attachment to our subjugated way of thinking.

In my lowly estimation, anarchism struggles with a lack of critical analysis regarding the nature of our oppression and that of our oppressor(s) as well.

3

_caspar_ wrote

from what I remember it was a situationist inspired take on the spectacle with attempt to update it (maybe?, its been awhile). there were also a couple of follow-up critical essays that folks might be aware of. I forget which, but I remember one being pretty solid.

"This book explained that young girls are the ultimate symptom of capitalism, because they are only worried about appearance and consuming makeup and whatnot. This is of course not true of all girls, including gender-conforming ones....So it was along the lines of 'girls with makeup are the face of capitalism', which thankfully they renounced following harsh criticism."

this sounds like a shallow surface reading with a denouncement incentive behind it, and Im not entirely sold that your summary is entirely Tiqqun's take. I would say calling their theoretical character "the young-girl" was a bad strategy, and your commentary shows why.

2

ruin wrote

I now assume that anyone referencing a text HAS NOT actually read it. Seems to be the safer assumption when online.

Why engage with primary sources when there’s social media, blogs, forums, and Wikipedia to inform our thinking?

4

southerntofu wrote

I forget which, but I remember one being pretty solid.

I'm interested if you ever remember.

this sounds like a shallow surface reading with a denouncement incentive behind it

It is, as it is based from my bitter memories of this essay from many years ago. I'm also very biased as i am an anarchist and i consider the appellists to be a threat due to their modes of organization/infiltration.

3