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How to Handle Trolls.

Submitted by aiwendil in lobby

So I have noticed a lot of people attempting to engage in debate with a troll that is not here to learn about how leftists can believe what they believe, or what statistics or science supports our beliefs. In fact what I have seen so far is cherry picked and bad statistics citing in order to give the impression that facts will change their mind if only you engage in the debate. The fact is, the debate is not one that can be won with facts, or at all.

What the facts show is that White Supremacists are a much bigger danger in the US than any other domestic terrorist group... Or honestly any foreign terrorist group. The statistics in the US show people of color being arrested at disproportionate rates for crimes committed by at equal rates by whites. When a troll cites bad statistics, don't think for a second that correcting the misinformation will diffuse the situation, because the goal of those statistics is the same goal as a study like the Bell curve(which we now know was funded by White Supremacist groups and has been riddle with logical fallacies and false assumptions to the point of being completely discredited). The goal of that misinformation is to rope you in. This is the greatest tool of the troll... Like somebody trolling for fish, the internet troll needs a good hook as well. DO NOT FALL FOR THE HOOK.

They are here to crowd out our community, to make us give up and throw in the towel. They have successfully conquered sites like VOAT and 4chan and to some degree Reddit. I think we need to keep in mind that they are very dedicated and will resort not just to cheap manipulation, but to spam campaigns or anything they think will make this site less useable.

Now that we have established the operation and goals of the spammer, what can we do?

First rule: Don't feed the trolls. Second rule: Don't feed the trolls.

What does a troll eat?

Trolls eat attention and time. Don't give them either. With out the ability to report individual posts we are really relying on moderators to chip away at the spam and ban users. This is really time consuming for moderators so patience is your best friend here. If you see something you don't think a moderator has seen you can always message them directly and ask them to remove it.

Keep in mind, this is not their site, they have enough echo chambers, so when they come here and accuse us of building an echo chamber, I say, so what... Any time leftists put in time and effort to build a resource it is immediately under attack and/or it gets coopted for use by fascists. Lets work together here to make sure neither of those things happen. They can go back to Twitter, 4chan, reddit, Voat, facebook, stormfront or any number of racist websites that claim to support their free speech. We have no obligation to support the free speech of hateful morons. We have no obligation to engage in debate with somebody here to "spread their ideas," or even to try to "understand ours," if they seem in any way disingenuous.

So when you spot a troll, resist to urge to respond, to contradict, to shout them down. That will only encourage them to continue and call for backup on other sites until this site is totally over-run and un-moderatable.

Thanks for reading guys, I really hope we can not fall into this trap where other corners of the internet have all caved.

Comments

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5

SpiritOfTito wrote (edited )

Mods need to be more happy with the ban hammer.

I've no interest in reading daily mail comments and I've even less interest in reading some racist pasty faced school drop outs racist opinions.

Mind you, I've not actually seen any of the nasty shit they were posting so chances are the mods have brought the ban hammer down swiftly.

In which case, good job ladies and gents

4

ziq wrote

Concern trolls are incredibly easy to spot if you've ever been around brocialists. Also.

3

aiwendil wrote

Indeed, but I have noticed a lot of people spending a lot of time arguing with a few bad actors that have no intention of making this site better, but in asserting some sort of moral superiority for their abusive actions. It is not productive at all. If somebody has asked you to stop doing what you are doing and you continue to do it, that is a form of abuse that we don't need to engage in here. So I think we could all use a reminder that they aren't here to debate in any productive way, so much as to dominate narratives that they already dominate on their home sites. There are plenty of places on the internet that will engage them. We don't have to. That time I think is better spent actually figuring out ways to banish them back to 4chan or whatever dark chasm they came from.

3

ziq wrote

My strategy is to out-troll them, but I think I'm gonna do your non-engagement thing now because this particular concern troll is boring my skin off.

2

sudo wrote

I agree, but I think it's important to point out that this only applies to trolls. If someone seems legitimately interested in debating leftist ideology, and they want to discuss in good faith, I think it's good to engage with that person, because you may actually convince them. I'm sure the current fascist trolls will quickly grow bored of trolling if we follow this tactic.

3

aiwendil wrote (edited )

Absolutely. Furthermore that is really up to every individual to decide, but I think once we know what to look for with trolls, it helps us to not fall for the trolling.

I definitely want to debate with people and share ideas and actual confirmable science and facts to challenge how I think(like how quantum mechanics experiments show that particles can change their path based on some randomize event in the future... like that is a seriously challenging idea), but when somebody says something like, "look at chicago, there are a lot of _____ people there and it's got lots of crime," This is not an actual statement of fact, because there are plenty of other communities that demographically mirror Chicago and don't have the same issues with gun violence for example(that is just one way in which a statement like that is intentionally misleading). That kind of cherry picking is specifically designed to hook you. They know it is going to hit a nerve for a lot of people and then that is likely to cause an anger infused debate, which those guys seem to thrive on. So I think the best thing is maybe to educate people on spotting the hook and avoiding being ensnared by it so these guys do get bored and go away.

1

adhdferret wrote

Ok let's not take Chicago.

New Orleans, Atlanta, Trenton NJ, Furgeson, or the many others where it is majority black. I will let you pick one.

-4

adhdferret wrote

How will you increase your numbers if you refuse to engage in discussion with someone you think is a suprememicist?

You say they have conquered Voat, but I don't think you really know what communities are cornerstone of Voat. Subverses such as /v/traditionalwives or /v/traditionalhusbands are actually more diverse and people even share ideas in those places.

Voat is what you make it obviously much like this place. I do know that our admin (either one) has ever wished harm on anyone. My first interaction with this place had that. Within 2 comments.

4

ziq wrote

We don't talk about Voat in this place. Voat is not relevant in any space.

2

adhdferret wrote

Noted. I will respect it. Just didn't see any rules in the side bar preventing it.

Want me to edit the comment?

4

zod wrote

1

adhdferret wrote

I don't see how that is relevant really. Admin made a comment to which I didn't see any rules within the side bar preventing it.

I asked a polite question. Hell this is your house, and I am not here to shit in the living room and wipe my ass with the curtains.

0

ziq wrote

When did you sealions learn to type anyway? Those keyboards must have some giant keys.

2

ziq wrote

It aint a rule, you're just assuming we think about voat when we don't. No one cares about voat.

1

adhdferret wrote

Alright.....

What do you think about then?

3

[deleted] wrote (edited )

0

adhdferret wrote

Seems like too risky. Burning down a church would be bad karma for sure.

0

[deleted] wrote (edited )

3

ziq wrote

http://i.imgur.com/CMxIuWE.png

They know all about making bad karma, I almost feel bad for their comrades.

2

[deleted] wrote (edited )

1

ziq wrote

I know I'm shitting myself thinking about them coming half way across the world to arrest me for telling this guy I hope he gets robbed.

0

adhdferret wrote

Actually he said he was going to rape my son and murder my wife. Somewhat a bit more extreme than what you did.

-5

jhasse wrote

Do you care about increasing your numbers though?

3

ziq wrote (edited )

I honestly don't give a shit about convincing white Americans to be anarchists. Americans are too comfortable and/or conditioned to change the world. But that's just me.

-3

jhasse wrote

Do you care about increasing the numbers of raddit users?

4

ziq wrote

Not if it means kowtowing to racists and pepenerds. Or we may as well just keep using reddit.