Recent comments in /f/Ukraine

uanon OP wrote (edited )

Well I also referred to settler attacks like the Huwara rampage as pogroms during my much more frequent talks with some russian pro-Israel liberals elsewhere (who're rather impenetrable to reason, I must say), I don't think there's anything contradictory in using this word in both cases, especially because Hamas, Hezbollah, PIJ&co are plausibly genocidal against Jewish presence in Palestine (and pogroms happened before the pivotal 1948 as well, e.g. in 1929 in Hebron). Similarly, Israel was founded through ethnic cleansing (a pretty universal thing for states, including existent and wannabe ones), so it's not a big leap towards being genocidal with a government right-wing enough. I don't think about this conflict in black-and-white terms (esp. given that the Palestinian movement and allied Arab states have always had antisemites and outright Nazis and Nazi collaborators in their ranks, sometimes opportunistically, sometimes ideologically, or a mix of both), and I don't think some Hamasnik oppressing Gazans and being a wannabe oppressor over the rest of Palestine is a good guy compared to some Holocaust survivors gunned down on a bus station in Sderot.

I wonder if you have something to say about Black people killed by Hamas on Oct 7 then, like Tanzanian Joshua Mollel. And other non-Israelis and non-Jews. Or Palestinian citizens of Israel. Or Bedouins. And so on.

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uanon OP wrote (edited )

Friendly fire deaths constituting the minority of total deaths (not surprising if you have studied some other similar standoffs, hostage-rescue situations and so on) doesn't change the fact that the vast majority were killed by Hamas-led militants. Some people see an incident like this and decide that Hamas didn't really kill anybody. Which is ridiculous and also, given that often the people loudly saying these things (and often exagerrating them) fully celebrated the attack, it's unclear why exactly they even mention this - if Hamas attack was to be celebrated, dead Israelis are good either way, whoever's projectile killed them.

Similarly, instances of Palestinian rockets failing and falling inside Gaza constitute only a tiny minority of Palestinian casualties, most of whom were obviously killed by Israel.

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yaspora wrote

I don't think I said any awful shit

You called the Hamas thing "pogromist", which is wild because pogroms are mass violence used by oppressor groups against the oppressed. In the Levant, Palestinians are the oppressed & Israelis are the oppressor, so you got it precisely backwards.

Hamas's statement is obviously propaganda, but it is Israelis who've been actually carrying out pogroms against Palestinians & Black refugees for about 2 decades. I'm sure you won't change your mind but now people who missed that comment know what the deal is.

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kano wrote

No I didn't because I was mad at you.

you being skeptical of the source was not my issue as I hope was clear. people accepting all claims made by any (authoritarian) group at face value are probably making a mistake. I'm not going to quote what you said here but if that wasn't your intention then idk if its a language ting or what but 100% I think that what's you did.

also just so we are clear I didn't ban you because of holocaust relativisation. that's not really my issue. I'm not really sure that 'nothing is like the Holocaust except the Holocaust itself'. I banned you because you compared violent armed anti colonial reistance to the Holocaust - which should also probably be understood as one of the more extreme examples of colonial violence. and fits in pretty perfectly in a long line of fucking atrocities committed by various imperial powers. hope its clear.

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uanon OP wrote (edited )

I don't think I said any awful shit, and you didn't give me a chance to answer by banning me from the relevant forum. My intention wasn't to compare Oct. 7 to the Holocaust (nothing is like the Holocaust except the Holocaust itself) but to resist denialism of blatantly obvious atrocities that were commited. Then again, if some people choose to believe lies from a Hamas propaganda document over what their own eyes and extensive documentation tells them about intentional killing of civilians, Jewish and non-Jewish alike, it's their choice.

I have significant disagreements with the linked article and find it dishonest in numerous ways.

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Lettuce OP wrote

Omg! U don't want to get blown up to fight against bathrooms for gender neutral ppl!!! /J

Ikr this article was so funny to read. I Mena depressing bc homophobic regime but also like damn talk about going over the top.

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Sid_Knee wrote

and wikipedia is a particularly trustworthy site? Believe what you like about the NED but it's pretty open knowledge that it is just another way the USA interferes in countries around the world, and I'm surprised to find people here don't know that https://countercurrents.org/2022/05/the-national-endowment-for-democracy-a-second-cia/

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kano wrote

That's a fake news website and the KHPG financs are open you can see they received $35000 from the NED in 2019 and that's one of the smaller grants it received.

and KHPG provide good information in English at least about Ukraine.

so don't try to spread pro russian disinformation on this forum please.

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uanon OP wrote (edited )

This doesn't look like a particularly trustworthy website lmao

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_Policy_Research

(also recommends russian disinfo on its pages regarding Ukraine)

Even if NED funded this group (which it doesn't, according to their open funding list - they list plenty of current donors from various countries, there's no reason to hide anything), it's mosty just a bureaucratic grant giving org with a variety of receivers, thinking that it means shadowy CIA manipulation of countless organisation is some certified nonsense

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