13

Is it really wise to praise people like Castro, Mao, Lenin and Stalin when they never actually achieved communism and instead killed a lot of people they shouldn't have killed?

Submitted by _ziq_ in Socialism

I just feel like it does more harm than good to cling to these flawed figureheads when it just allows liberals to throw their crimes against their people in our faces to debunk communism. Whether or not you think they were trying to create communism, they failed miserably.

Comments

You must log in or register to comment.

10

DissidentRage wrote

Even if they hadn't committed atrocities they would've been snubbed by the US before achieving the complete dismantling of capital. It sucks that they did bad things and we should always temper our historical memories of them with their individual atrocities, but that shouldn't be our only takeaway. There are still important lessons to learn from what they did.

8

marx wrote

Don't let perfect be the enemy of the good.

6

Naokotani wrote

Learn from what they did well and what they didn't do well.

Yesterday I had someone tell me that he didn't read Hegel because he was a racist. Does the fact that he was a racist mean that absolutely everything he said and did was total nonsense? Of course it doesn't.

5

moon_princess wrote

Let's divide humanity up into two groups: people who achieved full communism and people who are fucking shit. That is surely a productive basis on which to judge people.

1

[deleted] wrote

1

ziq wrote

  1. Tankies.

  2. Cubans.

1

[deleted] wrote

2

Dumai wrote

if you really want to know who castro killed you are perfectly capable of using google to bring yourself up to speed with basic history

please don’t patronise people b/c they don’t feel like talking you through very simple high school level knowledge

-1

[deleted] wrote

2

Dumai wrote (edited )

... no i did not learn the names of thousands of cubans in my secondary education

i nevertheless knew the fidel castro regime was marked by political executions, extrajudicial killings, and forced labour camps (that targeted, among others, gay people)

if you didn’t know that, that’s okay! but you could have fucking googled it rather than speaking down to somebody who knew better

1

IamSlavojsallergies wrote

They created socialism. Communism (classless, stateless society) is not possible in a predominantly capitalist world. Defending yourself against capitalist states requires a state.

That said, who's praising them? Recognizing the achievements of socialist societies doesn't require hero worship of guys who did indeed "kill a lot of people who shouldn't have been killed".

0

Hueyp_wants_his_soup wrote

Oh dear god, I came here hoping to escape the traps of the ignorant left and managed to fall right back into it.

How bout you go and find out the damn truth and stop regurgitating the bullshit. Not recognizing the socialist gains in this world is a sure fire way to cripple your own arguments that socialism works, has worked, and continues to work just fine.

If you can't even refute bullshit for yourself how are you gonna do it for anyone else? May aswell just throw Marx in the trash, call all commies tankies and keep looking for this mythological, magical "third way".

Go join a communist or socialist party that's not a Trotsky circlejerk and you'll soon find rational people who have put in the work to break free from western imperialist lies and distorted truths you charlatans all subscribe to.

What a joke.

1

_ziq_ wrote

Why would I join a vanguard? That's literally never lead to communism. Lenin, Stalin and Mao gave us no 'gains', they crippled communism for 100 years.