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emma wrote

Gotta be 3 & Knuckles, as it overall feels strongest on gameplay, level design and music to me. Mania is definitely up there, but I'm not fond of the reuse of classic stages. Also the bosses kinda suck.

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ziq wrote

mania is 3 parts remix, 1 part new

i hate the special stages

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subrosa wrote

Dr. Robotnik's Mean Bean Machine if that counts. It's the only Mega Drive game I ever finished, it was a big moment in my childhood :P

I think I played a bit of Sonic 3, but I really don't have a clue about that franchise.

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Vulgar_Soda OP wrote

Respect to anyone that can beat Robotnik in a bean contest. I barely managed to muscle my way through the lightbulb monkey bot ... as an adult! Puzzle games are hard ;_;

I wonder if you could beat the game today?

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nulloperation wrote

I didn't find the Mean Bean Machine too difficult, even Dr Eggman, yet I haven't been able to make it through the first stage of Sonic Spinball.

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subrosa wrote

Yeah. I heard a few times that it's supposed to be super difficult, but I doubt it is when 8-year-old me could beat it. Maybe there was different versions for Genesis and Mega Drive or something.

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mofongo wrote

I've only completed Sonic Adventure 1 & 2, and Sonic Generations. So, Sonic Generations.

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ab5 wrote

Sonic Generations was fine until the rocket transformation and the half-finished end boss.

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mofongo wrote

I was so confused about how I was supposed to fight it. Took me a lot to figure it out.

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Quicksilver wrote

I really liked the one where you played as shadow and silver. I think it's because my babysitter as a kid used to bring her gaming consoles and games for me and my siblings to play, and we played that one a lot. Never really got into the sonic fandom, so dont know how it's rated by them in general, nor have I played it recently enough to make a more wholistic decision myself, but atm, that one.

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ziq wrote (edited )

that's an interesting pick lol

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_games_notable_for_negative_reception#Sonic_the_Hedgehog_(2006)

never played it personally

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nulloperation wrote (edited )

Never played that one either, but one youtuber describes it as "The Room of video games."

so dont know how it's rated by them in general,

I don't think it's rated highly. Apparently many glitches and weird romance cut scenes.

I found the first level of Sonic 3 very striking, with the whole colour palette swapping as the rainforest is torched. You encounter this round flying robot with a dead funky theme tune, but before you can finish it, it covers the entire screen in flames, and it's all on fire. This is terrifying to play through as a kid, but definitely one of the best Sonic cut scenes, managing to explain the story with no words, but with blocky-yet-dazzling colours and sounds. I think Sonic 3 zone 1 and Sonic 2 level 1 and 2 are most relevant from environmentalist point of view.

Ironically, Sega had an advertisement deal with McDonalds then for which the deadline caused Sonic & Knuckles to be split off as a later release, which is so damn tragic because of McDonald's involvement in deforestation of the Amazon rainforest.

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Vulgar_Soda OP wrote

managing to explain the story with no words

This should be standard across all genres. Long winded unskippable cutscenes are anathema to gaming.

Ironically, Sega had an advertisement deal with McDonalds then for which the deadline caused Sonic & Knuckles to be split off as a later release

I learned something new today. My go-to S&K3 fun fact was always the bit about Michael Jackson being involved. Though, I'm not even sure how real that is.

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nulloperation wrote

managing to explain the story with no words

This should be standard across all genres.

It can be interesting when cut-scenes are somewhat interactive but I'm definitely not against using words in games. Contemporaries like Earthbound or Zelda: A Link to the Past have dialogue but it works well.

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Vulgar_Soda OP wrote

It can be interesting when cut-scenes are somewhat interactive

Ehhh. I immediately think of Quick Time Events and those not-cutscenes where a character walks slowly through a hallway while the player is force fed exposition. Both are scripted events that take away player agency while offering nothing but the oh-so-magical written word of failed Hollywood aspirationals. The best games offer meaningful choices. There is nothing substantial behind a series of button prompts where the reward is continuing with the actual game. Just more unskippable cutscenes under the guise of interactivity. Luckily, the two SNES RPGs you mentioned understand that the medium demands laconic prose. Earthbound especially would not be half the game it is without all the colorful dialogue, but thankfully, the game knows to keep its wit short and sweet. Metroid Prime is a straight up action game, but so much of the mood is set by optional descriptors that the player must read through to gain a sense of the world around them. Key word being: optional.

I guess, I don't so much mind dialog or words or whatever, so much as I mind control being taken away from me for extended periods of time, without good reason. Shitty anime plots acted out by mediocre actors are not a good reasons.

Do you have an example of an interesting somewhat interactive cutscene?

DISCLAIMER: I've enjoyed some visual novels, VA-11 Hall-A being a recent one, and that's like the most words-words-words you can get. I'm also a fan of the Metal Gear Solid games, a series infamous for long cutscenes. Perhaps, I am full of shit.

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ziq wrote

I fully agree. I hate being forced to read/watch cutscenes in a game. Same goes for clunky mechanics that take you out of the game. I play games because I want to zone out. That's why my fave games are fully immersive experiences where the game becomes an extension of my brain: tetris effect, rez, (2d) sonic, street fighter, ikaruga, blazing lazers, tobu tobu girl.

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ziq wrote (edited )

It's real. He wrote sonic3's music. That's why it never gets rereleased with the original music

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emma wrote

It's not that black and white. He was involved, but it's not known to which extent. We do know Brad Buxer, who worked with MJ, wrote the Ice Cap Zone music among other tracks, for instance, and we also know a bunch of the music was done by Sega's own composers, but it's not confirmed that MJ personally composed any music for the game himself.

See https://info.sonicretro.org/Sonic_the_Hedgehog_3/Development/Music

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Quicksilver wrote

Huh, fair enough. Figures I'd remember fondly a game so reviled

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ziq wrote (edited )

both sonic 2 and sonic 3 & knuckles are equally matched with different strengths and weaknesses

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nulloperation wrote

Some underrated classics are the Master System backport of Sonic the Hedgehog (which is a completely different game) as well as Sonic CD.

Sonic 2 split-screen multiplayer was more interesting than Sonic 3.

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ziq wrote

sonic triple trouble is prob my fave of the 8bit ones followed by sonic pocket adventure

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Vulgar_Soda OP wrote

Sonic 2 split-screen multiplayer

I wish this was expanded on further in subsequent sequels. I settled so many sibling arguments with Sanic speed racing. I found 3's multiplayer an odd choice. It's a straight downgrade from Sonic 2's.

Wish there was some kind of Advance collection too. I'm usually against ports and rereleases, but the Sonic GBA games are so underrated and I wish more people would give 'em a shot. That, and I'd like to try the multiplayer without all the cumbersome cables.

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nulloperation wrote

Mednafen server works well for Sonic 2 over LAN on regular laptops with keyboard input. I only tried the GBA Sonics briefly, but they look like great new games (rather than just ports) yet still with proper crisp 2D graphics, but not sure how network would work as presumably it's made for one input controller only? (not sure if any emulators can emulate multi-console networking?)

Does Sonic Mania (which you described as "the best") have any networked multiplayer? I'm wondering how it'd run in Linux on Wine, and whether it'd be necessary to sandbox it to prevent it from doing any unnecessary network requests?

That's part of the appeal of the earlier Sonic games: that they can't phone home (and hence not any possibility of adding loot box functionality or similar)

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AnarchoDoom wrote

It's Deux Ex, by Ion Storm. Thank you. :)

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