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nulloperation wrote

I think you have a desire to negate any criticism of veganism as an ideology or praxis, perhaps because it is crucial to your identity. Frankly, if this is the case, This is a shallow way to explore politics and I encourage you to try on other shoes before you keep on your walk.

Yea, when I see people who I love and respect for their work in fighting a cruel system being dismissed as "liberals" engaging "almost entirely [in] a consumer practice," then it saddens me. I feel the need to express why their work is of tremendous value to me. You are right that is a part of my identity, but how exactly is that shallow?

But to pretend there isn't substantial liberal recuperation happening in these examples you brought up, is to basically refuse to acknowledge the reality.

I think you are correct in this, and while that's also true for veganism, that's quite far from the initial assertion, that "veganism is a liberal ideology". There are many vegan anarchists and, yes, there's also a lot of anarchist anti-vegans spewing out a lot of bunk, like, say, Peter Gelderloos' apathetic argument that death isn't really sad anyway:

The Western tragic ideal, which is inextricable from the capitalist war against nature, presents death as a bad thing, and apparently so do some vegans, but to the rest of us, this only appears as philosophical immaturity.

I think the carnist bunk needs to be addressed the same way racist and sexist bunk needs to, and while I think you're making some valid points, this thread is still rich with nonsense carnist distortions. It's just sad in the same way racism and sexism is, especially in an anarchist space.

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ruin wrote

You’ve made points that I both agree and disagree with, but I think your last statement is my issue with this discussion.

By framing it as carnist vs vegan is to take dietary choices (regardless of their motivation) and frame them as ideologies.

In doing so the conversation will obviously be tied to ideals and absolutes and lacking in nuance as you keep pointing out.

I was hoping the op would clarify the context of the blog post itself. It was about karmic attribution which seems more interesting and nuanced than an ideological moral argument about veganism, and I don’t believe in karma...

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