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sudo wrote

Join a communist party, and help overthrow capitalism. That is the only way to end institutional misogyny once and for all.

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kittybecca wrote

"we'll fix everything after the revolution"

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[deleted] wrote

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mofongo wrote

The revolution is abolishing things not fixing them.

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jadedctrl wrote

I think they mean “fixing problems” rather than “fixing institutions that cause problems”. At least, I hope they do. :-P

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kittybecca wrote (edited )

Being pedantic is the revolution

But seriously, it's not, it's just a way for leftists to assert dominance over one another and has absolutely nothing to do with social change. This, along with vague proposals to end capitalism in order to solve someone's emergency situation, is the kind of silly "leftism" that promises a lot and delivers nothing.

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Zzzxxxyyy wrote

You’ve read Marx right? Revisionism kind of doesn’t work...

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md_ wrote (edited )

To be fair, Marxism also kind of doesn't work :)

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[deleted] wrote

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Zzzxxxyyy wrote

Yes it is what it sounded like to me, especially given in contrast to the previous quote about revolution. I guess in that, as I see it, it’s not just fixing things, but you have to tear down the old broken things first.

Agree with you. Marx had his flaws when it came to implementation, but he had witnessed revisionism being used by the bourgeoisie to quell the rage of workers while still oppressing them.

The thing I always wonder about is if it’s really possible to build a better state when your baseline state no longer resembles the state you initially sought out to change. So, I guess I’d argue it needs to be torn down fast and hard enough to limit the power of the bourgeoisie to rebuild it in their favor, but slow enough you know what the fuck is going on.

One can dream.

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[deleted] wrote (edited )

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Zzzxxxyyy wrote

Well, in your example I still don’t see how you’d go about deciding money is worthless without tearing town the prior government, military, police, financial system, etc that enforces the value and power of capital.

Seems like we’re getting lost in symantics here, but you’re correct, revolution is dangerous and no one should be naive about that.

Obviously, you would try to leave as much physical and intellectual infrastructure as possible, but tearing down the social and economic power structures is a must for “revolution.”

And I’m surprised people get up in arms over someone disagreeing with them on the Internet. Maybe they’re angry with their mothers and are directing it at undeserving victims. Hopefully as raddle matures those kinds of interactions will be discouraged.

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sudo wrote

Do you know of another way to get rid of misogyny besides massive social and political change?

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ziq wrote

What if your revolution never comes? Just keep sitting on our hands?

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sudo wrote

The revolution is not an apple that falls when it is ripe. You have to make it fall. - Che Guevara

I am actively participating in the local chapter of a communist party. I am trying my best to accomplish revolution as soon as possible.

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kittybecca wrote (edited )

Why do you think participating in the local chapter of a communist party is trying your best to accomplish revolution as soon as possible? It's no secret that many communist party chapters are simply leftist debate clubs.

It looks like it's more of a way for you to detach from reality, seeing as you mentioned it in response to this thread about someone's emergency situation dealing with misogyny. A genuine effort to recruit people into a communist party would involve participating in the struggles of the here and now so that people would see more of a reason to join your effort to build a better future.

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sudo wrote

It's no secret that many communist party chapters are simply leftist debate clubs.

This one does more than that. You know nothing about my situation. Stop making assumptions.

It looks like it's more of a way for you to detach from reality, seeing as you mentioned it in response to this thread about someone's emergency situation dealing with misogyny.

Because there are thousands, if not tens of thousands, of cases like this. If you donate to one person, that will only give them temporary relief from their pain, and it will do nothing to help the others who don't have the privilege of a large social media following to offer them financial support. Stalking and harassment are the symptoms of institutional misogyny. Do you want to treat the symptoms, or the disease?

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kittybecca wrote (edited )

The disease, obviously; why else would I be on Raddle? I just don't trust your ideas to treat either one. You've given no indication that you understand how your ideas and praxis are going to lead to the abolition of misogyny. All you've given are platitudes.

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ziq wrote

It's not enough and I think you know that. And even if we lived in a world where you being a member of some special club were enough, yet another Leninist vanguard isn't going to solve misogyny. Or anything.

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sudo wrote

It's not enough and I think you know that.

Revolutions can't happen instantaneously. It takes years of effort to educate and organize workers. It is you anarchists smashing bank windows then promptly getting arrested that aren't solving anything.

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ziq wrote (edited )

It is you anarchists smashing bank windows then promptly getting arrested that aren't solving anything.

All you're doing is showing that western MLs continue to be elitist armchair radicals that pooh pooh direct action and have a completely inflated sense of self importance.

You're not helping me or mine by being in a special club for Soviet history buffs.

I don't see a few social pariahs talking about their wishful 'revolution' to replace one authoritarian state with another authoritarian state as 'accomplishing' something because my head isn't up my ass.

You think you're solving the world's problems by going to your club meetings but you don't even have the self awareness to see that not even 0.00001% of the population are on your side. Your revolution is a pipe dream, and if it weren't (like if we lived in an alternate reality), it still wouldn't solve a thing, just like every other state-capitalist 'revolution' in history.