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2

captaindread1 wrote

Well, taking in account that there are a growing mass of anti-authoritarians humans, it would like to ask if human are able revert the situation. Catharsis.

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Tequila_Wolf wrote

Seems to have been a major contributor, at least. I'm not sure I'd call it the ultimate foundation or even necessarily the beginning of it all, though.

I'm open to a lot of anti-civilisation, anti-technology, and anti-mediation critiques.

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tnstaec wrote

Right. There have always been humans that did shitty things to others, but with the rise of civilization shittiness became codified into cultural norms. So while non-civilized patriarchies have existed, there have also been many non-civ cultures that approached things in different ways. It's with the rise of civilizations that male-dominance became standardized.

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ziq wrote

I guess the key is choice. If you have only one system that has its fingers wrapped around the whole globe, you can't get away from it and build your own society.

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__deleted_ wrote

I think you can make a strong argument that the advent of agriculture led to slavery, but that doesn't mean we can turn the clock back.

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bigOther wrote

Yes. The agricultural revolution allowed the production of surplus value. Once people could grow more than they could eat, they started fighting over who owned the surplus. IIRC Engels argues that this is also the origin of the patriarchy - before there was wealth to inherit, paternity was of little consequence.

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sudo wrote

No, that would be capitalism itself.

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tnstaec wrote

So before capitalism everything was fine and dandy?

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sudo wrote

Of course not. I'm saying capitalism is responsible for the current dystopia. I thought I didn't have to spell out that feudalism, slavery, and other primitive systems were also bad, but apparently I did.

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tnstaec wrote

That's exactly the thing I find so wanting in traditional leftism. There's no wholistic critique that includes the Europe's domination by the Church and aristocracy in the Middle Ages, or slavery in Babylon and ancient Egypt. That's why anti-civ analysis is so compelling.