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rot OP wrote

Reply to comment by celebratedrecluse in Ad Block on Tor? by rot

I'd like as much anonymity as possible. I was looking for an adblock that would block ad elements without compromising tor

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celebratedrecluse wrote

Nothing will do what you ask.

If you want more security, then install adblockers and realize it will single you out as a different tor user than the rest of the crowd, decreasing your anonymity.

If you want more anonymity, don't install adblockers, and realize your Tor Browser will load a bunch of ads, trackers, and other bullshit, decreasing your security.

EFF has a good primer on the differences and relationships between security, anonymity, and privacy. Unfortunately, it's basically a zero-sum game.

In general, regardless of your choices, assume Tor Browser activity on clearnet sites (hidden services less so) is easily discernible by a concerted law enforcement surveillance inquiry (correlation attacks), and is also subject to a lot of corporate surveillance (through the ad networks, etc).

If you want anonymity, don't use the clearnet, even over tor.

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quandyalaterreux wrote

In general, regardless of your choices, assume Tor Browser activity on clearnet sites (hidden services less so) is easily discernible by a concerted law enforcement surveillance inquiry (correlation attacks), and is also subject to a lot of corporate surveillance (through the ad networks, etc).

Bad advice, the Tor Browser already offers the strongest first-party isolation and anti-fingerprinting defenses that you can hope for.

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celebratedrecluse wrote

fingerprinting is an entirely different issue from correlation attacks, so I do not think you understand my point. Here is a discussion which describes what I am getting at

https://security.stackexchange.com/questions/48502/tor-traffic-correlation-attacks-by-global-adversaries

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quandyalaterreux wrote

Do you realize that there is not a single low-latency anonymity network that is immune from this attack?

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celebratedrecluse wrote (edited )

yes, absolutely! Tor is not uniquely vulnerable to this, it's just (by far) the most commonly used anonymizing network which bridges to the clearnet (these attacks seem to me to be less easy when attacking a hidden service, such as I2P, or the .onion sites, but yeah it is still possible if you can monitor all internet traffic in a region/globally)

don't get me wrong, I use tor. I think everyone should, it's a great tool! http://lfbg75wjgi4nzdio.onion

However, these tools are a far cry from a free & open internet. Even while using tor, people should be aware that the powers of the corporate and government surveillance apparatuses are fucking incredible, and that certain actors will always be able to circumvent even the best practices for online safety.

So my point is that we cannot expect that these individualist measures will overcome the fundamental political economy of the internet, which is of course capitalist, just as the rest of this mass society is part of the overall capitalist system. What we need goes beyond these individual opsec measures, it must encompass an overall transformation of the political economy of the internet, from this oligarchic capitalist mode of production, to a democratic anarchist system that is built to not require trusting centralized authorities (ISPs, CAs, DNSs, router manufacturers, cellphone companies, etc), and in emplacing popular democratic control over whatever centralized institutions/practices might still need to exist (eliminating end-user fees for internet service, mandating universal standards for production of devices and networks to resist surveillance/abolish censorship/respect privacy, etc)

Using tor is a great, but easy, first step. Other things that you can get involved with are the creation of meshnets, local ISPs, and municipal/rural ISP projects (careful of the neolibs involved with the latter, though...government-controlled internet has a very dark potential). Here is an example of people taking things into their own hands in Detroit, using digital technology to empower marginalized people & serve their communities better internet in a less capitalist way https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1B0u6nvcTsI

We need mass movements, local and global networks, to take back our privacy & abolish the surveillance state. Take individual steps, but walk a collective path-- and let no one be left behind!

It's a long road, but I like for people to consider the big picture, and be careful of not getting overconfident with their particular praxis-- especially if that praxis is isolated at the level of individual consumer choices.

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rot OP wrote

Got it. New to this sort of stuff so this info is helpful.

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celebratedrecluse wrote

I figured. Glad to see more people looking into this stuff! And very happy to help, to the extent of my knowledge. :^)

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