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10

Dumai wrote (edited )

i think cosmetic surgery is a predatory industry that preys on the insecure and functions on beauty standards that are highly racialised and deeply unhealthy

plastic surgery also happens to be medically necessary in a lot of cases (i mean take gender dysphoria as an example) and people who judge others who choose to have it done are more often than not sexist/racist asshats so

9

sudo wrote

People should be allowed to appear the way they want to appear. The only bad thing about it right now is the prohibitively high cost.

8

ChaosRocket wrote

People should be able to make their bodies look however they want. Few people would say it’s wrong to dye your hair, get tattoos or piercings, or get braces to straighten your teeth. I don’t see how any other kind of cosmetic surgery is any different.

6

selver wrote

I'm with the transhumanists on this one. The ability to change one's appearance is a freedom we are lucky to have in our lifetime. It should be considered a human right.

The ascetics telling people that they should just be happy with the body God has given them are not to be trusted. They are enemies of individual desire, subjectivity, & freedom.

6

md_ wrote

The only argument ITT that came to close to standing up to scrutiny was the idea that only the well-off can afford plastic surgery therefore it widens the class gap. But that's not an argument against plastic surgery, it's an argument against capitalism.

I didn't have a universal position before, but after this thread I feel "NHS should cover all plastic surgeries".

5

Tequila_Wolf wrote

I think that anyone can do what they want with their own bodies and needs to make their own decisions about what's best for them, but I would encourage people to be aware of how society creates and shapes our desires, and to make sure that the norms we subscribe to are prefigurative rather than norms that reinforce the hierarchies of this world.

5

amongstclouds wrote (edited )

Itt: cishet brocialists wax on about how people just need to get over themselves and develop a personality.

4

selver wrote

Yeah that rhetoric is so dismissive of trans people & dysphoria in general.

4

ziq wrote

I don't think it's anyone's business how anyone else wishes to present themselves.

3

yaaqov wrote (edited )

The society I live in puts an enormous, and unevenly spread, amount of pressure on people—those read as women especially—to conform to beauty standards. As long as that's true, I'm not really interested in placing a value judgement—positive (e.g., 'exercising personal freedom') or negative (e.g., 'sending a bad message about beauty')—on the actions or reactions of the people most vulnerable to the violence that patriarchy musters for nonconformity.

2

kore wrote

It's impossible for me to separate the causes of my desire for plastic surgery. On the one hand, I want my body to look different, but on the other hand I can't tell how much of that is affected by societal norms and ideas about bodies.

2

ergdj5 wrote

Problematic in that it widens the gap between classes in allowing all upper class to be conventionally beautiful whilst not offering such an ability to the lower class.

2

carol wrote

I think it's great. Even if some uses are problematic, for a lot of things it's just the best option.

2

robottroymacclure wrote

i would also add that there is already so much beauty in the grotesque. people should accept and appreciate how being cool and not conventionally attractive is way better than just being normal ho hum perfectly symmetrical and normal looking. if youd rather be different i want to see people attempting to be DIFFERENT! get your teeth filed down, put silicone implants in your forehead. Be a freak. :)

2

parias wrote

It's a nuanced and personal question. There's a tension between the individual desire to be attractive and to reap the benefits of that, and the desire to abolish (or at least, not support) our societal standards for beauty. We should despair for the construction of a world where it's expected we all receive cosmetic surgery--look to places like South Korea for examples of this. In the end, it's a personal choice.

0

noordinaryspider wrote

Even if you do have a nonstandard physical appearance, think about the message this sends to other people who cannot afford to have their bodies "fixed" to conform with artificial standards of beauty.

There is risk with any surgery. Being accepted by shallow people isn't worth dying over.

Our relationship with our bodies also changes over time. Parts of my body that I hated in college have become comfy old friends in middle age. Maybe it would be better to talk about why you feel your body is unacceptable and how this pain affects your daily life.

Humans are capable of change.

0

selver wrote

Even if you are starving, imagine the message this sends to people who cannot afford to "fix" their hunger!

-1

amongstclouds wrote

My dysphoria is gone oh wow thx

2

jadedctrl wrote (edited )

I think she was talking more about someone wanting to change their bodies to look more attractive— not about SRS or anything transition-related, since that's a necessity, not about “trying to look more attractive.”

3

noordinaryspider wrote

Yes, but I should have thought about where I was and who would be reading it before I clicked on "submit" and I apologize.

SRS isn't plastic surgery in my mind any more than fixing a broken bone or pulling a tooth.

It's not your job to read my mind. I made a mistake. Please accept my apology.

-1

Zzzxxxyyy wrote

I personally think you’re better off investing in learning to accept yourself as you are.

However, I’ve dated a couple women who were very insecure about their appearance and both got nose jobs. One, I can barely tell the difference, but she’s quite happy with it(though it did nothing to resolve her insecurities). The other had a lot more drastic change done and she’s very unhappy with the results.

It also comes with a minimum of one year to recover and see results. One full year of your life, when your current outward appearance maybe matters for 10 before your aesthetic preferences change.

I’m not going to go into the theory of it, but there’s nothing unethical about spending your money how you like as long as there aren’t obvious externalities. You personally are not going to make a change in established inequality locally or globally, charities are mostly scams.

So you have financial cost, time cost, risk of a bad result.

Or you can find some hobbies with intrinsic value, compensate by being fashionable, go to therapy, invest in deep meaningful friendships, family(if you’re so lucky) and a loving community.

I also found after some mushroom trips I was much less judgemental of my own appearance. Life drawing also helped as I became more aware of how different everyone’s bodies and facial structures are.

-3

rib wrote (edited )

Edit: nvm read some of the comments and realized people here are incapable of respectfully responding to a comment they disagree with.

Have fun in your echo chamber y'all.

4

retiredaccount wrote

Is the "comment we disagree with" something along the lines of "suck it up buttercup, dysphoria doesn't real"?

-4

robottroymacclure wrote

in cases of physical disfigurement it becomes a medical necessity. otherwise, i might respect someone less if i knew they had work done for frivolous reasons. still it is your right to do whatever you like with your body.

-7

ThisGuyIsAProblem wrote

Put the money into a better personality, not a better smile
Unless your a vet with half their face blown off and eyeball hanging out of the socket

5

ziq wrote

curious - how can you buy a personality?

-2

ThisGuyIsAProblem wrote

I think the more appropriate word is character, but your 'personality' is a combination of several aspects including mood, knowledge, appearance, skills, and assets. By focusing on an ideal characteristic and using intent, it's possible to progress oneself in that direction. People who focus on health indeed become more conscious about healthy decision making and it changes how they identify themselves as well as how they behave.
The easiest way to buy personality is to identify what identity you want for yourself, and then purchase the assets associated with that particular identity. By using those assets, you will begin acquiring the same experiences as the character you want to become, and in effect, start to become.