Viewing a single comment thread. View all comments

1

zorblax wrote

How about a thought experiment: if someone had extremely vivid thoughts of murdering everyone they'd ever met, for their entire life, but never acted on them and were in fact very normal people outwardly, are they bad people? Do they deserve to be feared?

2

Dumai wrote

depends. what kind of personal history do they have? what sort of cultures do they live with? what is their position within matrices of power? do they get any pleasure out of these thoughts?

it could be that they're somewhere on the anxiety spectrum and that these thoughts are intrusive, meaning they're actually wholly unwanted and upsetting. it could be that they're an abuse victim who uses thoughts of violence as a coping mechanism. it could be that they're a shitty white dude fixated on a violent masculine power fantasy, in which case these thoughts will be connected to their personal racism and sexism.

now here's a thought experiment for you: how about you actually engage with what i've been saying this whole time?

1

zorblax wrote

How can you judge someone for their conscious experience and not their actions?

1

Dumai wrote

do you not see how the two are obviously linked or what

1

zorblax wrote

I can understand how, a posteriori, they're pretty obviously linked.

But it's obviously incredibly wrong to punish someone before they've done anything.

1

Dumai wrote (edited )

when did punishment become a part of the conversation?

would you negatively judge somebody who professes racist beliefs without ever "acting on" them (the line between two is probably more blurry than you're assuming)?

1

zorblax wrote

when did punishment become a part of the conversation?

It was always? Or am I totally missing something

would you negatively judge somebody who professes racist beliefs without ever "acting on" them?

beliefs can be changed without intensive therapy. Pedophilia, or psychopathy, or <insert something else awful here> is part of a person and it takes more than an illuminating conversation to change it.

3

Dumai wrote (edited )

beliefs can be changed without intensive therapy. Pedophilia, or psychopathy, or <insert something else awful here> is part of a person and it takes more than an illuminating conversation to change it.

given how many people are already trying to define racism as an expression of mental illness or otherwise psychological impulse (much in the same way you are trying to do with pedophilia) we'll see how long this belief lasts but have you ever noticed how ex-white supremecists actually tend to spend a lot of time in therapy? have you ever noticed how overcoming culturally instilled racist beliefs and behaviours actually takes years of effort? what would your opinion be of somebody who doesn't even bother to try because they like themselves that way?

1

zorblax wrote

what your opinion be of somebody who doesn't even bother to try because they like themselves that way?

I'd obviously hate them.

I've only met one pedophile I had any respect for. He really didn't like that part of himself, and tried to suppress it. He got a lot of shit when he told people about it. He's really the only reason I made this comment in the first place, because I know people like him exist and I think they're treated unfairly.