hirao OP wrote
Reply to comment by An_Old_Big_Tree in Do the people on this site not support left-unity? That's the impression I'm getting, but why? by hirao
Authoritarian values and perspectives.
Anyone who thinks Marxism promotes authoritarian values doesn't have a very good understanding of dialectics or historical materialism. The laws of the development of human society (historical materialism) show us without a doubt communism is an inevitability. The productive forces (technology regarding production and the skill of labor regarding production) will develop to the point of the necessity of the socialization of the means of production (as Stalin points out in "Dialectical and Historical Materialism"). There's nothing authoritarian about this natural progress of social development, not any more than a lion is authoritarian for eating a zebra. It's just natural.
An_Old_Big_Tree wrote
🤮
existential1 wrote
We should add a counter to the site for "Days since someone posted about how dope Marxism is _"
[deleted] wrote
GlangSnorrisson wrote
I love it. Taking a quick break from doom and gloom to dunk on tankies is self-care.
[deleted] wrote
GlangSnorrisson wrote (edited )
I’m sorry to hear you find them boring and tiring. It’s probably different if you mod forums.
Mostly I wait until they say really ridiculous stuff, and then repost that to meta_ lol.
GlangSnorrisson wrote (edited )
How undialectical!
mofongo wrote
doesn't have a very good understanding of dialectics or historical materialism
that's a cop out. Show me where Marx speaks about any of those things.
And even if Marx arguably doesn't, Left Unity promoters follow Stalin and Mao, which do promote authoritarism.
The laws of the development of human society (historical materialism) show us without a doubt communism is an inevitability.
Society is not a straight line where one thing leads to another. Things may appear like it does with the power of hindsight and cherry picking (which Marx did a lot).
The productive forces (technology regarding production and the skill of labor regarding production) will develop to the point of the necessity of the socialization of the means of production (as Stalin points out in "Dialectical and Historical Materialism").
And yet, it has not happened. Additionally, we're in a process of collapse on which socialization of production is meaningless. Making Coca-cola a cooperative won't prevent it from manufacturing plastic.
There's nothing authoritarian about this natural progress of social development, not any more than a lion is authoritarian for eating a zebra. It's just natural.
That's like saying that capitalism is part of human nature. There's nothing natural and unavoidable on the shape of society humans arrange themselves into. Historically, that sort of thinking only leads to dehumanizing those that don't share your views.
hirao OP wrote
Joseph Dietzgen came up with dialectical materialism after Marx died, but based on Marx's theories. Marxism is more than simply the writings of Marx...
Making Coca-cola a cooperative won't prevent it from manufacturing plastic.
Of course it would, we would democratically opt to switch to plant based polymers.
There's nothing natural and unavoidable on the shape of society humans arrange themselves into.
Then you believe capitalism will go on forever? That's ignorant of the way society works. Perhaps natural was the wrong word... It's scientific. Capitalism has to fall away to communism in the end because it cannibalises itself by its very nature. We have to embrace communism in order to survive.
mofongo wrote
Joseph Dietzgen came up with dialectical materialism after Marx died, but based on Marx's theories.
He came up with it independently from Marx and Engel.
Marxism is more than simply the writings of Marx...
Also Stalin's and Mao's.
Then you believe capitalism will go on forever? That's ignorant of the way society works. Perhaps natural was the wrong word... It's scientific.
You got it backwards, when capitalism collapses it doesn't mean that communism will take its place. This inevitability of history it's nothing more than blind faith. Moving heaven from the sky above to an earthly utopia.
Going from natural to scientific does nothing to eliminate the metaphysicalness of it.
We have to embrace communism in order to survive.
I have no interest to live in a soviet or Chinese style totalitarian society.
Pop wrote (edited )
every tank is a parody of theirself
rora wrote
Much the same can be said for anarchists. Uncritical dogmatism from all sides must die if we are to gain any ground.
Pop wrote
most 'anarchists' have shit politics but all tankies have shit politics
GlangSnorrisson wrote
Oh great another visitor.
rora wrote
And?
GlangSnorrisson wrote
We’ve had a string of entertaining guests these past few weeks. I’m wondering if you’re a part of that or not.
rora wrote
I've been lurking here for ages, got fed up of Leftbook and the influx of Vaush-bros so i made an account
GlangSnorrisson wrote
Yep and I saw your other comment. My apologies, I assumed you came here to shout at us about China.
thelegendarybirdmonster wrote
Tankie gutter is this way >> chapo.chat
hirao OP wrote
You shouldn't misgender people just because you disagree with them, and using "tank" as an insult to attack any communist is just juvenile.
videl wrote
The laws of the development of human society (historical materialism) show us without a doubt communism is an inevitability.
Where's this optimism coming from? It seems more likely every day that human society will lead to cybernetic hellscape or total collapse or some fucked up mixture.
ziq wrote
ideology is pretty similar to religious faith
thelegendarybirdmonster wrote
Do you think that progress is linear and that people are better off today than say 500 years ago and that 500 years ago people were better off than 1000 years ago?
Do you believe that technology brings happiness?
Do you believe that society naturally tends towards your definition of "anarchism/marxism"?
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