Submitted by __algernon in Anarchism (edited )

Code pink radio (go to 36:00)

Heard this and thought by Chris Hedges and thought it was pretty interesting.

The psychological mindset of the military and law-enforcement necessarily involves chauvinism/us and them/superiority to justify and enable killing and violence. I think that enabling killing is very hard. Most healthy people have a lot of natural psychological barriers to industrial scale murder. It must therefore be heavily ingrained.

I think that if you have this as a key principle it can kind of explain macro-behaviours of policy from military leadership, and how it falls into traps of anti-immigration, fascism, racism, etc.

One might also consider forms of divide in business narratives eg "consumers/service providers", and the dehumanizing consequence and effects on business behaviour.

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Fool wrote

Those violent military people are nothing like us! We should get rid of them!

🐿️

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__algernon OP wrote (edited )

Haha yeah good point to think on. Some thoughts. Firstly, stating an effect of training on later behavioural patterns is not chauvinism because it doesn't reference a personal trait, it references a changeable thinking pattern.

Secondly, I suppose this joke references "emotivism" or the "boo-hurrah" theory of morality - if one was to draw your conclusion from what I said - "get rid of the military people" which is apparently also a form of chauvinism one has to justify why this is "better": In the Boo-hurrah theory moral statements don't have truth value, they are just expressions of how we feel about something, so my chauvinism based on military thinking is no different to racism and it's just how different people feel.

I personally think there are empirical and obvious mechanistic justifications for why "getting rid of the military people (possibly through retraining)" is good chauvinism, but "kill all the enemies" is bad. Such as the measurable complexity and value of the human mind.

Pretty limited understanding of ethics here, but that's my two cents.

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Fool wrote

Oh... I wasn't thinking anything beyond juxtaposition of military into the enemy.

The us vs. them mentality is highly prevalent in the online "left"

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black_badger wrote

who cares what the scurrilous anti-anarchist Hedges has to say? who cares what the scurrilous anti-anarchists of code pink have to say? fuck those left-liberals.

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__algernon OP wrote

Do they have a bad reputation? I hadn't heard of them before.

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black_badger wrote

Medea Benjamin complained in Seattle 99 that the cops should have arrested anarchists. Fuck her

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__algernon OP wrote

I saw a few pretty bad reviews on their glassdoor, so this also kind of tracks... well, at least I learned something.

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RanDomino wrote

Chris Hedges is a piece of shit who should never be forgiven for "The Cancer in Occupy".

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Shame_Pity wrote

I know a few ex-military and one in particular heavily emphasied about how ''The military changes you'' and ''They literally beat the civilian spirit out of you and turn you into a soldier''.

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__algernon OP wrote

did they talk about enemy/us and civilian/solider categories?

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existential1 wrote

If nothing else, the military develops a mechanic in your brain to always identify the enemy, real or perceived, and prepare for the worst according to that assessment.

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__algernon OP wrote (edited )

I lived with a wannabe cop who did the same thing. Also read that some cops get psychological problems where they can't turn off the paranoia and it creates problems for their partners.

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Shame_Pity wrote

They didn't really talk too much about enemy/us things (I believe they were one of those medical focused ones) but they did talk about distinctions being made between civilians and soldiers.

They really only ever mentioned this stuff in passing.

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Zb0 wrote

Was was ALWAYS about power and money...NEVER for the greater good

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