ziq OP wrote
Reply to comment by EgocomLad in "Rulerless" my ass by ziq
automating mass extinction so workers have more time to go shopping
can't go wrong
celebratedrecluse wrote
Hey it would give me a break from manually operating my own extinction, that's really soul-sucking work right there
EgocomLad wrote
How do you propose we continue to produce quality consumer electronics without relying on exploitative labor, then? Are you saying we should just accept capitalism and stop criticizing the current model?
OdiousOutlaw wrote (edited )
How do you propose we continue to produce quality consumer electronics without relying on exploitative labor, then? Are you saying we should just accept capitalism and stop criticizing the current model?
Wow, that sentence says a lot.
The environment shouldn't have to be destroyed to produce something that you don't even need to live.
People shouldn't be forced to work themselves to the bone in factories that destroy their environments and suck the joy out of their lives so that a few people can have a flat-screen.
Many of the consumer goods that exist in the West today are only made due to neoliberal, neocolonialist structures such as the IMF; unless you can prove that similar consumer goods can be made en-masse without environmental damage and without exploiting the lower class, you'll have to make the choice between the production of consumer goods and the abolition of Capitalism.
EgocomLad wrote
You took what I said out of context by not including what I said in the previous comment. I proposed automating (as much as possible) the extraction of materials necessary to produce those goods so that exploitative labor would no longer be necessary. I support the abolition of capitalism. The machines that would be used to extract those materials would be owned by the workers who operate them. Smash every screen you own if you actually believe what you are saying.
OdiousOutlaw wrote
How do you mine for electronic materials without destroying the environment?
Why would the Global South allow Westerners to continue to exploit their environment for consumer electronics? You know that many of the materials that go into making electronic goods aren't abundant in so-called first world countries, right?
Smash every screen you own if you actually believe what you are saying
iF yOu WAnT tO DEsTroY CApItAlISm, wHy YOu HAve COmPuTER?!
celebratedrecluse wrote
Well, we could, just not produce the electronics.
Or more realistically, halt some production through direct action, thus driving the price up, and try to help people organize in the reduced production for a greater value of their labor and better work conditions, which operate by reducing available production capacity so that the laborers have more control collectively.
Either way, if you're full anticiv or more of some kind of mutualist flavor, whatever, the ideal scenario is one where less stuff gets made and less stuff gets to people. it really strips down to more essential production, and some people advocate for no production at all.
If you want more production, you have to be more extractive, which means you have to just intensify the oppressive force on proletariat, the environment, indigenous people, and in general the devil's axes we hate
ziq OP wrote (edited )
destroy the means of production and all that destroys life
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